Rfalconcam Forum

Early in 2004, I was doing some research for my Dad, Fred Vickers, (formerly the oldest member of this group) about a peregrine falcon stamp.  Funny...now, I don’t even remember if I found the information Dad wanted...  Because I clicked on a link to Kodak, and saw the most remarkable sight! I saw Mariah and Kaver, standing in the nest box!  I looked, turned to my husband Kevin, saying in amazement, “Look!  Those huge birds are actually there – in that box!  And they do move!!  LOOK!!”.  I laugh now, when I think about it, as I am now quite familiar with nature cams, to seeing sights I never, ever thought I’d see.  But then, I was out and out astounded!!

And, already addicted, I kept returning to that site!  It was the first thing I saw when I got home from work, the last thing I saw when I went to bed. I just couldn’t get enough of it!!

A few days into my reverie, Kevin pointed out the scrolling Discussion Board.  I read and was caught up in the friendship, the excitement, the thoughtful way everyone was treated!!  Kevin told me to join in -- to tell how excited I was!  But I was shy... However, Kevin being Kevin, pushed until I finally gave in and said, “Hello...I am a Canadian...”. And, do you know what all you people said? You said, “Anne – Canadian -- Welcome!!”.  Just that. And I was hooked!  I was in love!  And, until recently, that has been how I’ve always felt about this group.  About all of you!  That you are the most remarkable, the most accepting, the kindest people in this world!  You have made me laugh, cry, just feel so unbelievably good about myself, my world!  And, you have all seen me through terribly dark, heart-breaking days...

By the end of that first amazing peregrine season, I, the iamnotanaddict, wondered how I would survive the peregrine being gone, all my friends disappearing.  And then I heard about kfalconcam.  You had to “apply” to join this group, stating why you wanted to join...  Would I be welcome?  Who would be there?  Again, I look back and laugh at my shyness!  When I finally did send in my form, it was accepted right away and I found myself with now old friends, friends who said, “What took you so long?”!!  Perhaps it’s good that I was shy, because the receptions I had now received twice, are still very clear, very important to me.  If it had been easy, maybe I wouldn’t realize how important This Group has been to Me!

I know!  Anne is going on and on... But, I had to make sure that you all know how very important this group is to me, how much I’ve grown in confidence, in knowledge, in person, because of this group!  How I’ve made friends, who I can never replace,  never let go, because of what they are like, what extra mile they always walk for me. 

Because, I have a few things to say to this group, about this group, right now...  And I do need to make sure you know that this is coming from my heart, not a bruised ego, not out of baseless anger.

Right off, I was unhappy when suddenly I found myself in this Forum format.  I was stressed by the divisions, the subdivisions, saddened by the lack of free-flowing conversations, the absence of feedback...  I know I don’t “do” change well, that I can be stubborn.  I was told to persevere, adapt!  So, I really did try!  But then I realized that I wasn’t alone -- people I was used to seeing, weren’t around...more and more not around anymore...  I got no feedback, I felt no joy, no excitement, no love...  And this continued...week after week, month after month.  I have been so intensely sad...

And that brings me to a few days ago.  As usual, I headed for the friendliest sections.  The area where the ABCs of Birds have been racing happily forward, where you people are teaching each other about birds, where there is clear enthusiasm, support, laughter!  I went there first, because I found there, a little of what I was so sorely missing.  And then I headed for OT, where people talked about real things, real problems, where people asked for personal support and talked about things they really cared about!  I enjoyed the “Sayings of the Day”, the competitions we “contributed to”, the laughable bird myths!  And that’s where my reading usually ended...

But, as I was leaving, I spotted the word “LOGO”...  Now, I must say – my father-in-law, a top-ranked person in advertising, has taught me about logos.  Ergo this word peaked my interest.  So I looked.  And found out that some nameless people, WE wanted to change our present logo to something “dynamic”...  I’d seen no poll, asking all of us if we understood why...  Well, maybe I’d missed it...  And although I love the old logo – it has Kaver on it! – I knew it wasn’t strong, eye-catching.  So I checked out the entries...and found nothing exciting, eye-popping, very rfalconcam positive...  I spent a long time looking, thinking, looking again.  And then I posted my suggestion – that one artist had submitted two logos and, if he could combine them, taking the best from each, we would have a fairly good option, that had a chance of working, a logo we could all live with...

But, right on the heels of my post, another post appeared...that said we must not make “down-grading” comments, must not “scare off people” submitting these logos, as basically we would look ungrateful to those “wanting to design our new logo”... (Post Reply #47).  One thing this person failed to say was that these presumably well educated designers would be paid $300 for their efforts...  Anyway, as want will have, being generally thrown off by my life’s circumstances, I got angry...and I yanked my post, even though I didn’t think it was unfounded, critical or rude.  I let my anger get the better of my commonsense, my ability to make good decisions...

And then I carried that anger forward and posted a question, enquiring as to who this WE was, who made this unilateral decision in the first place, was.  Who this was that seemed to control everything that happened on this Forum, without ALL of us knowing or understanding.  Without asking us, the members, without whom this Forum would be a barren and dead place...  Yes, I did know that I would be setting myself up for criticism, ridicule.  I am not stupid.  I was not born yesterday.  I do not think that I can say things and not expect a response.  And I was not disappointed...

The answers came from two chief people over this group.  From two people, who have always worked very hard, very diligently, beyond exhaustion, for the maintenance of this Forum and the cams, the actual centre of everything.  Their replies were at first, to the point, and after my reply, to placate.  What I expected.  Now, Do Not Get Me Wrong.  I do have respect for these folk.  They have done more for this group than I ever would have dreamed of.  They have nurtured it unfailingly.  But – and there always is a but – I feel like I don’t have any say in My Group anymore. I feel I am really nobody to anyone, anymore.  But I swallowed my hurt, my insignificance, and replied humbly to both responses.  And I meant what I said – I did not mean to suggest that these folk haven’t worked unendingly, unswervingly for all of us...and I truly couldn’t do what they do.

But something amazing happened in the midst of my abject apologies – I saw a beam of sunlight... Aafke, one of our distant moderators, in Holland, Dot in PA, Kris G. and Carol in WV, posted, supporting me.  It’s been a long, long time since something like that has happened.  They dared to stand up for me, against those in the inner circle.  And they made me cry.  And I am crying yet again, as I write this...  You four made me feel like I was back where I want to be...on the old Discussion Boards, where I always knew what people thought about what I said.  I know I can be disruptive, say things that are taken badly by some.  I will always apologize if I make a mistake.  But I do tell the truth.  I try to express myself clearly.  I do my utmost best.

Bolstered by this unexpected support, I have to say that I feel that these two chiefs, representing the inner circle, have forgotten that we are all The Group.  We are not followers, who do not understand if included, who do not say “Thank You” enough.  We are the members, who you are ignoring, by changing things right out from under our noses.  We are the members, who, if we ask questions, are told to behave, to not be critical, to not be upfront, to not be disruptive.

There, I’ve said it.  And I am positive that I am going to hear about it.  From these chiefs themselves, but also from members of this group, who have never experienced the comradery, the fun, the absolute joy and love of the old Discussion Boards.  And I’ve asked myself how I am going to react...am I going to get angry and pick up the challenge, will I not be surprised and bow my head and know that I have stepped out of line yet again...  Will I have to apologise, admit failure to friends, who told me not to bother, that I have too much going for me to waste energy on this fight myself, who say, “Anne, Anne, Anne...What am I going to do with you?  I don’t know.  The replies may be again couched in pleasant correction, in sarcasm or in the removal of my membership.  At least, I know, that all of you will know.  Whether you might miss me or welcome the sight of my back...well, I shall see...

I’m sure some of you are still wondering why I am doing this.  Writing ‘way too much.  Bothering you.  I’m doing this, because I really and truly do care.  I miss the multiple members we have lost during the change from kfalconcam to rfalconcam.  When is the last time you heard from Hannah in London, England, from Mirta in Patagonia, from Jim in Atlanta, from Judy in California, one of our distant moderators?  In the past, when one member disappeared, we would all join forces to find them.  We cared, we worried and we went searching for our missing friend.  Do you remember the hunt for Robin, who just evaporated into the Ether...  A search branching from Canada, all over the United States worked endlessly, costing members precious personal time, not to mention money on long distance calls.  But you know, we did find her.  We did tell her that we missed her, that we were sorry that there was illness, problems in her family, that we wanted her to come back, so we could help, support her.  We honestly gave her the whole group’s love.  So I have a question for you – in May, soon after my adored husband of 38 years died suddenly at the age of 59, I got upset about a matter raised privately by a few members about two members, and I quit this group.  Did any of you miss me?  A few close friends were sorry that I had done this, but not one person in the Forum even noticed.  None of the inner sanctum asked me why I left, told anybody...  No one even said, “Thank goodness she’s gone!”.  Nothing.  Now there is only a faint whisper of that caring, that really, really honest caring left.  For me, for the hundreds of members, who have left.  That is so sad, so unacceptable, so very, very sad...

Anne in Toronto

OH I see you put this in OT, so I deleted my orig post and will post it here also:

Anne, I think everyone has their own opinions on this Forum. It was a very hard adjustment from KFC. I miss the closeness we all had on KFC also as do many others. Indeed, we lost many a member but no one says we can't go forward with the KFC group, (it's still there) but no one posts anymore. I too have tracked down Porkchop and some others from the old group and was saddened by what I read. Remember B-Ner, I have written to her and yes, she responded. She was very busy with family matters. It's hard to remember all with 1300 + members from KFC. It doesn't mean we don't care, we just have memory lapses from time to time. I'm sure others get mad at me for my 7000 plus posts but that's me, I'm a frequent poster, always have been and always will, until I get told to stop. When no one responds, it's OK, I don't get upset, I just put it out there. If you want to read it, you will, if you want to skip over, go ahead. I read EVERY post, I don't respond to all but I read them.
I agree, we need to be more involved with things that change on here. After all, without members, there is no Forum, no donations, no nothing. I think it all started when Mariah and Kaver were no more, they were the KEY to all this in the first place, well for me it was. I didn't know Cabot-Sirocco back when, I knew of only Mariah and Kaver. People are still adjusting to Archer and Beauty, (myself for one). When they left, members left. There's nothing we can do about that now but we can enjoy what we have and that is Archer and Beauty and their new legacy.
Anne, try not to take it personal, if no one responds to your posts, it doesn't mean we are heartless, it means we read it and have absorbed it. Thanks for your input and don't be a stranger or lurker. :)

Anne, first I want to say I'm glad you are here and to thank you for speaking your mind.  If no one says anything, no one knows there is something wrong.  

I have actually been pondering the changes in the dynamics of this group.  I think it actually dates back to when Kodak decided to wipe its hands of the falconcam (and, subsequently, the falcons).  Suddenly, our social group that formed to keep in touch with friends during the off season became the ONLY access to the falcons.  Roles changed-and I do thank, from the bottom of my heart, every single person who stepped up to the plate to keep "our" falcons available to the world.  If they had not-I shudder to think where we would be right now.  But it also had to become a business-a not-for-profit, but a business none the less.  I think in many ways we're still working out all the kinks.  I don't know what the answer is, but if people are feeling left out, then we need to discuss it.  

I have been feeling lately that this forum is finally settling in and feeling more interactive like the old board (ABCs of birds as an example).  Maybe it's just "growing pains".  I don't know, but I do know that EVERY member is important. Every single one, whether you express an opinion or not. Period.  

We will figure this out.  Ei

Anne,

Thank you for being honest and giving your angle on the changes. My angle is different, but I do hear and understand yours.

There was something wonderful and very special about the old group that bound me to it for a long time - it was a unique conjunction of really wonderful people from all over, and a shared love. It inspired me to hang out in late-night chats with a terrific bunch of nightowls, write long silly poems, make jokes, create falcon drawings by the score, and do elaborate photoshop collages. Aafke's ABCs threads have some of that old feeling, for me.  Most important, though, I am still, every day, immensely grateful for the cherished acquaintances and real friends I made as a result of that particular unexpected community --  which, yes, has to some extent gone as people, good people, disappeared.

This forum is an entirely new creature. It developed a new hierarchy to replace the Kodak one; it has more cams, more resources, and still, without a doubt, TONS of passion on the part of on-the-ground watchers, internet watchers, and fans. It still is very important for LOTS of people.
But no, it is not the same at ALL. It's much better for some people, impossible for others.  

In any case, I think that it is important and admirable that you have had the passion to say outright how you miss the old community, as a community.  I don't think things like that can be reversed, per se, but if individuals care enough and are brave enough to observe and publicly speak out when they find some "soul" they cared about has been lost, who knows, maybe some new soul can be found - or appear.

dale

I'm pretty new to falcon watching. I started in 2008, the last year Mariah and Kaver spent on Kodak. I fell in love instantly. There was some in fighting (for lack of another term) going on at the time and so I just lurked. Things seemed to work themselves out and I'm sure they will now. Anne, I'm sorry if I caused you any upset by my post about the logos. I was not pinpointing anyone in particular when I wrote it. I thought I would be helping not only the designers of prospective logos but also preventing any future negative commenting. There are plenty of supportive,loving and caring people on this forum! I too, was saved by them and the falcons. I have so many friends now that I can hardly keep up! Friends that I know I will have forever.
   Everyone has an opinion and everyones opinion matters, but as my late,great mother always said "if you don't have something nice to say about someone then don't say anything at all"! I hope you will continue to participate on this forum and I encourage everyone to share their opinions and thoughts. After all you can't have a forum without them! 
Sincerely,
MAK

I very rarely reply to anyones post but I do read them all.  First on the yahoo groups Kflaconcam site and then transfer over to the Forum.
I have always enjoyed your posts (I remember the one about the baby pigeon).
So, please don't give up on us.  -Ruth

Hi Anne,

I felt your post was worthy of being a separate topic, so as a moderator I changed it, and then it found its way to OT.  Thanks for speaking your mind.

To give you a brief update...Judi in California is still a moderator, but has not had much time to participate like she used to.  Baerbel's priorities have changed with looking for a new job, and it seems everyone's time is more limited than it used to be. I agree times have changed and so have forums. Buffalo doesn't even have a group of watchers, or a forum to follow anymore. The Syracuse forum is almost defunct, the Cleveland board has a steady few that participate on a regular basis depending on the topic, just as members do on Rfalconcam. People don't have the time to follow forums like we used to, and many are active on Facebook.  Mirta and Jim in Atlanta are active on FB, as many of my other falcon-watching friends.  I often stay connected with members through facebook, rather than on forums.  This allows me personal communication on a one-to-one basis that we don't have on forums anymore. Plus I am not as technologically challenged anymore, and I'm staying in touch by texting.  I never thought at my age I woud be texting like a teenager.

As mentioned, Rfalconcam is no longer a forum with a big company behind it providing support. I am proud Rfalconcam is successful so far as a nonprofit business in this terrible economy.  It is run mostly with volunteer help (and many who have full-time jobs as well).  The organization has experienced constant growing pains. I hear your primary concern with the change with the personal touch of the forum.  

Rfalconcam's mission is not only a webcam & forum but is..."To increase environmental awareness and education by providing high quality still images and video of the peregrine falcons in their nest box as well as information about the peregrines, educational material and other items of interest."  I wonder how many people have actually read that on the home page, or do they link solely to the forum?

I am not part of the Rfalconcam organization, and don't have the time to participate on a regular basis due to my commute and work obligations, so my contributions are via donations, moderating, and watch reporting.

I know the organization is constantly improving and many forum members are involved in any way they can.  For example, Dumpsterkitty has been working on the family tree, Donna continues to post news on peregrine falcons, Canadian updates, etc., and MAK and Carol are posting daily watch reports via twitter (which we never had this frequently in the past).

As stated, there is a lot of heart, passion, pride, and a sprinkling of ego. Not a bad recipe to keep things going.  I know that any ideas are welcome to better the organization, and volunteer help would be most appreciated.  I personally can't wait to retire cause I have a great idea that I want to work on (not telling what).

I hope that the website will eventually include an outline the Rfalconcam organization, staff, and it's committees. It would be helpful for everyone to know who the "we" are.

Anne, it saddened me to read what you wrote, and I am hoping you'll stick with us.  Having met you, I know it came from your heart.

Kindest regards,
Joyce

Anne, I'm really happy that you posted. I have to admit, I haven't even read the logo posts so I am not sure what that is about.  I do think it is wonderful to have posts from people who have become friends on this site.  I do miss the old forum and still have trouble finding things on this one.  I think though, that it is a process of evolution just as the cams have been.  And we will work through it all,together.
Our precious Mariah and Kaver brought us together just as they brought their wonderful babies into this world

And Donna, I actually am waiting for you to hit 10,000

Anne, first, thanks for posting your thoughts.  I wanted to respond to a few of your comments.

I understand how you might have been hurt by the suggestions on the Logo thread to avoid disparaging remarks, but as MAK said, I don't think they were directed at your comments.  MAK's reply was a followup to Lou's, who specifically encouraged us not to post "sarcastic" comments.  And though sarcastic comments are why we love some of our members, Lou's suggestion was well taken, and I didn't think it was in response to your post or any of the posts giving constructive feedback. That's not to say that your feelings aren't valid; obviously they are, and we've seen many times in this forum and in life in general, that we all bring our personal and cultural assumptions, biases, and mental models to any dialogue, and two people can read or participate in the same exchange and come away with two entirely different understandings.

I also think that asking forum members for feedback on the logo choices was a way to give members a say in the group.  In any group of nearly 600 members (and a vast army of camera/video watchers who aren't members), there have to be leaders and committees and people who keep us organized and steer the direction.  I have felt that when there is an opportunity to solicit group involvement and feedback, they try and do that, but perhaps my feeling is different from yours because I don't have much time to be heavily involved, and looking at forum logos and providing minimal feedback is about all I'm really able to do (in that specific example).  To Carol's point, they do occasionally ask for volunteers for specific tasks (EI's maps, for example, or help with family tree software).  I know I volunteered one year (long time ago) to take a shift gathering data for one of the charts (incubating or feeding).  There's a call for a volunteer now over in the "2010 Holiday Cards" thread.  It's hard to make a democracy out of a large and always evolving group; members' ability to give of themselves changes over time.  But the process (polling) that resulting in keeping Beauty's original unofficial name was certainly an example of the "leadership" letting consensus win.

I think there are lots of things that might contribute to lost members and a sense of dislocation...losing the nest on the Kodak Tower was certainly the start of a bad time; Mariah's loss of her territory and a year without a successful nest probably made it hard to hold the interest of a lot of members who primarily came to watch the leetle falcons grow up.  The change in forums probably left folks feeling like they'd lost one home and didn't feel quite comfortable in the new one.  I do think people's lives change: their priorities change, the amount of free time they have changes, and perhaps their interests change.  I think there may be people who have "moved on" for these reasons, and even when we add new members, the absence of our old friends makes us feel that the community is dimished.

The change in forum structure was probably another factor...though once I learned to use the "Show unread posts" link liberally as my navigation method, I actually learned to prefer this forum style.   It lets me, like Donna, read ALL the posts, but read them in context.  I'm also much more likely to respond to a thread now, because I tend to catch up on posts late at night (or in the wee hours of the morning).  On the old forum I would start from where I left off the night before, and might see a post I wanted to respond to...but by the time I got to the end of the day's postings, the conversation might have moved on to several other topics, and I wouldn't necessarily feel comfortable interrupting a current topic to address an old one.  With the "threaded" style, I feel like it doesn't matter if I respond to a message that is hours or days old, because I'm not interrupting any other topic, and my message will make sense within the context of that thread.  Of course, the threads themselves have a tendency to wander away from the original topic...so that's another issue...but since I read all the posts I just go with the flow!


But, all that said, the most important thing is that you continue to stick around and make your usual intelligent, insightful, interesting contributions to these discussions!

Patti

Anne, I'm glad you posted, but so sorry that you've felt this way.  I don't keep up with the board that much (too much other stuff going on) and mainly check during nesting/fledging season.

I've been around since 2000 and I know when the Kodak boards shut down we lost a lot of folks.  Hey, we lost folks each year during the Kodak time!  Anyone remember Alison?  How about the bathrobe brigade? And there are a lot of others I remember that we no longer hear from.  Transitioning to this board was difficult, but I've learned to like the threaded parts as I can quickly check the latest information.  Sometimes, when I have time (like today), I roam around the rest of the site and catch up on vacations and other topics. 

I tend to agree with a lot of what Patti said -- and it's sometimes sad that nothing stays static -- I don't always react well to change, either!

Just know that you've always been an important part of this "family" -- we loved your dad's comments and I'm so very, very sorry to hear about your husband (shows you how much I've not been around). 

You stick around, ya hear?
Vandrefalk

Anne,
I am relatively new to this forum, just since last summer....I found this site as the link to it was on the NJ Duke Farm Eagle cam page. I clicked on it and fell in love with Archer, Beauty, Callidora and my beloved little Jemison.  My friend Patrick who lives in Belgium had been following along with me the falcons on the web cam from the cathedral in Brussels near his office at the Congress. I sent him the link to the Rochester cam immediately and every day we watched the adventures of our little fledglings. We were on the edge of our seats when Jemi fell twice and we cried together via gmail over him...Both of us sent donations to help continue the work and to help out with Jemison's care.
I love these falcons and little by little I am starting to feel more at home here yet sometimes I feel a little left out of the loop myself.  But I have been posting photos of birds I have seen around my area in NJ and I mean to stay and it is my utmost desire to come to Rochester for the next watcher's weekend.  I have friended Carol P, June Summers, Shaky and Jeanne on Facebook.
When I wanted to find out how I could send an additional donation to Jemison's rehabber I called Carol P. and she was so kind to me...we talked quite a while and she directed me to the proper channels to get the money to Jemison's rehabber.  So these people are all nice and as all of us in this hurried world busy and I think sometimes that can come off as lack of interest.
But that is not the case....it just comes down to everyone rushing about multi-tasking.
I don't post as much as I would like to myself but I do check in every night and I have read a lot of your great posts.
I am so sorry about the loss of your beloved husband.  I know the pain of losing ones you love.
I have lost both parents, a woman who was like my second mother, my aunt and a good friend who was senselessly murdered all in the space of a few years :-(
So hang in there with the forum, I think I can speak for everyone that you are wanted here and that everyone is important.
Light and love to you and all on this forum.  :heart:
Ginny (falconsforever129)   :)

 :falcon: 

:christree:

Anne, I think a lot of the things of which you speak are things that, to varying degrees, concern a lot of us.  While I appreciate the merits of the Forum format, I personally prefer the email list format.  (K@, please take note  :wave: )   Part of that, I think, is that I get a LOT of email, being involved in several interests, and really don't have time to go to Forums and dig for stuff.  This forum is the ONLY one important enough to me to visit, and even then, if it were not for the *wonderful* feature of forwarding the posts to the kfalconcam list, I would be missing most of what's shared here.  I don't believe Forums have the intimacy and immediacy of email lists, but with the advent of Twitter, for instance, there CAN be that immediacy for those "on the ground" in Rochester. 
There have been a few instances when I've had something I would have liked to share, as I did on the list many times, but couldn't find what seemed to be the right thread into which to post it.  Now I know how to get to OT :-)
I am touched to hear that my responses have meant much to you.  You have been one of us for a long time, and I was saddened to know that you have been hurting here.  Hopefully, this "from the heart" discussion will help to clear the air and give you back what you've been missing.  I've just spent some time reading very early kfalconcam messages, and seeing several names there that we don't see here on the Forum.  Of course there is always attrition, for reasons having nothing to do with content, but I think there are people that all of us miss in the day to day discussions.
Evolution is a given in any group, and there are things we lose that lots of us miss, even as new things appear.  But one thing has remained constant with this Falcon group, in whichever format, and that's the love we develop for one another even as we are all devoted to the wonderful Birds we all love.  Our lives are diminished with each loss, those of others here as well as our own, but we are still "family", and you're an important and appreciated part of it.  Thank You for sticking with us.
<stepping down from pulpit now>
Carol
WV

Hi MAK,
To expand a little more on my post to Anne regarding this I also meant to add in it a BIG THANK YOU to you, Carol and ALL the watchers who report to us daily.  I love to check in to see what Beauty is up to before I leave for work and I always sneak on Facebook to check Rfalconcam site there during the day to see what she has been up to.  :thumbsup:

Hi back Ginny!  I have to say that every time someone thanks me for watching and posting about our beloved falcons I am humbled by it. I'm more than happy to share what I see with all of you. ;D
   

Hi MAK!
Your postings really make my days!
I love those falcons!
Ginny  :happy:

This is hard... I don't think well "on the fly" these days...usually have to sit and think and then edit over and over again. But I am not going to throw out any excuses for how I write, how I think, how I feel. In this group, I now feel that they aren't necessary.

What I wrote earlier today, in fact through two sleepless nights, did come from my heart. A heart, I might add, that is feeling much warmer tonight. However, as perhaps I counted, not out of maliciousness, but out of a desire to find out where things really stand, I know that I pleased some people, made some people think for a minute, but I also hurt some people. And that does not warm my heart. It hurts it.

I am not a cruel person. In fact, my main "thing" that keeps me going through everything, is that I really care about people. Doesn't matter if it's a cherished friend or a street person, who has stopped to ask for a cigarette or a dollar... It's just the way I am.

And I hurt from the knowledge that I have not shown that I do care to some people, have in fact hurt them very much. And I can't just say, "Oh, I'm sorry!", because that won't fix what I have done. I got a personal email from one such person this afternoon. I don't know whether to say who or not, but I don't really think it will make any difference, as that person knows who they are, that I am talking to them. And that person has been badly hurt by me, is terribly, terribly angry. And I would be, too. I have gone out of my way to do that! But my hope, in doing that, was to get that person to say to me, that I don't know them, I don't understand what they are going through, don't have any idea what they love or how hard they work, to make this place work well for all of us. And that person is absolutely correct. For all my years in this group, there are areas of which I am totally ignorant. I have no justification for why. I won't make any excuses. But now I do know what that person feels, I do know how hard they work, I do know how hard it is to be separated by responsibilities. How hard things have been since Kodak dropped its support and left the survival to this person and their other inner group members to scramble for survival for all of us, our group. How hard it is to get volunteers to give from their hearts. And how terribly hard it is to try to be just one of the group, to be accepted just as a friend, to see dear friends drop out, breaking hearts and hope.

And now that I finally do know, have been rescued from my ignorance, all I can do is offer my hand in abject apology, offer my hand to start to correct wrongs done, offer my hand in friendship for that person. This person may be too angry to do that right away. I probably would be. So all I can do is repeat, as often as necessary, that I am glad that they yelled at me, got through my head that I have really, really not noticed all that is going on. Because now I know, for absolute sure and now I can do something about it. Now things can move forward, at whatever pace that person wants. And I do see a new friendship, where someday, we will look back, wonder how it all happened and laugh at what nuts we both were. I can but hope. Just a warning to that person -- I am very persistent, I won't go away, I do mean that I care for people and whether that makes any sense now, I do...

What I wrote about earlier, was partly an old dream, a wispy picture of times when I was happier, not so stressed, not so angry, not so hurt. When my life started to get difficult, I always had the discussion board to help me center myself, collect my wits to make it through another day. That made this whole group very important to me...  And to know that I could share some of my knowledge, some of my friendship to share with the people and very importantly all of my love for Mariah and Kaver and their wonderful families was wonderful. This group has been my center, my solid hold on reality at its best. And this is why I dream of things as they used to be.

But that is not realistic. I know that. But today, with your responses, I see that the "old group ways" are indeed still here, still flow from my screen. I also know, now that I have a new life, that I have to catch up with the new realities -- FaceBook, texting...just for starters. I didn't have time or ability to learn about these things before. Just couldn't. But now I can and will! I find it all very exciting! But it also means I am going to be bugging people to show me how to do these things. For although I have had a computer since 1979, was on the internet when it was just newsgroups, I have slipped behind the times badly, when I could do nothing else. But I will learn and will perhaps find even more of what I've been missing...

Thank you all for tolerating my dreams, my yearnings, my variant moods. I know that I can be annoying. But I am just a person, the same as all of you. We do the best we can and when that best is none too good, then our friends help us, guide us, so that we regain our footing. I now know that I have more than just a close group of friends from this group. I now know that there are a lot of people out there that do care, don't want me to go away.  So thank you from the bottom of my heart -- the one from which I wrote to you earlier today.   You did not let me down. Somehow I knew you wouldn't...or I wouldn't have written at all.

Anne in Toronto

All is good Annie.   :wave:

Now I expect you to be the first volunteer for a new project that will be starting very soon!  Just kidding.  Only if you want to.

Carol P.

Thank you, Carol!  Then, my world is now back on its right axis, spinning smoothly.  Thank you!  Alignment is everything.  I have found that the last few days have been an amazing display of what human beings have in their hearts.  Everything has shown up, ranging from "don't care" right through to "love & care very much"!  But I have noticed that the largest showing, by far, has been that of "love & care".  I know that I have been mistaken or at least unaware of what exactly has being going on around me in this group and that mistake has been corrected by all you wonderful people I know I can call friends.  I feel so much better and know that I am never going to have my world start wobbling so strongly again, when the group rfalconcam is there to make sure that that doesn't happen.  Your support over the last few days has brought tears to my eyes, but also has opened my eyes to exactly what does make this particular world run and how we all can work to that purpose.  I will do my very best to do my part -- and yes, volunteer, if the other volunteers will continue to help me to always head in the correct direction and not let me wobble.  But, heck, I guess I know they will, without having to question, before I ever get started.  But don't put me in any position where I have to write...because I always write too much!!!  :hysterical:

Thank you, all of you, and especially Carol P.!  :handshake:
 
Anne in Toronto :heartspin:

Anne....you are so very welcome!
 :heartspin: :heart:

Thank you!  :heart:  Anne